16:13:33 <sri> #startmeeting
16:13:33 <Services> Meeting started Wed Sep 10 16:13:33 2014 UTC.  The chair is sri. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
16:13:33 <Services> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
16:13:49 <sri> first topic..
16:13:54 <sri> #topic debconf
16:14:03 <sri> okay, oliver, take it away
16:14:25 <aday> agenda is here - https://etherpad.gnome.org/p/engagement-team-meetings
16:14:44 <oliverp_> right so there was a intresting panel about the deafult desktop in Debian
16:14:48 <sri> thanks
16:15:48 <oliverp_> and it was agreed to set-up a wikipage that list the possible options, pro & cons
16:16:15 <andreasn> so like no final decision?
16:16:41 <oliverp_> andreasn: no, but its getting closer, they said something about 6 weeks
16:17:30 <oliverp_> can post a link to the wikipage
16:17:51 <oliverp_> its quite comprehensive
16:17:55 <aday> oliverp_, that would be interesting, thanks
16:18:03 <sri> what I've heard is that it is quite likely that GNOME will be selected
16:18:10 <sri> the decision will be in 6(?) weeks
16:18:26 <sri> one compromise is that GNOME will be on x86 only
16:18:26 <oliverp_> sri: they something like that yes
16:18:46 <sri> mostly because with the points stated it was mostly aligned
16:19:28 <sri> we aren't out of hte woods yet
16:19:29 <sri> :)
16:20:03 <sri> what else, oliver?
16:20:11 * sri will let you finish before he starts
16:21:06 <sri> #info talk on default desktop - setup a wiki page with the list of pros and cons being mae.  Decision will be made in 6 weeks.
16:21:40 <sri> #info from multiple sources say, high liklihood of choosing GNOME based on selection criteria, but likely only on x86 platform
16:22:12 <oliverp_> don't think there is much more to add
16:22:26 <sri> okay, I'll let people know what I've been doing..
16:22:36 <sri> so, I spent a couple of evenings schmoozing.
16:22:38 <oliverp_> it was a great conference
16:22:44 <sri> cuz you know thats what I do :-)
16:23:02 <sri> anyways, I was at an HP event, and I had talked iwth a bunch of HP people about desktop market
16:23:04 <oliverp_> and of course, Portland was wounderful
16:23:12 <sri> HP is tryin to come back to open source, after some time outof it.
16:23:20 <sri> yay portand :)
16:23:53 <sri> the talks were pretty good, there does seem to be a recognition that it might be good for business to invigorate the desktop market.
16:24:37 <sri> I made further progress a couple days later at the systemd talk, where hte speaker wore the t-shirt that I printed out :) (lennart wore it at fosdem)
16:24:55 <sri> turns out I had a fmaily connection with someon in the team
16:25:16 <sri> I'm going to try to meet with the HP R&D director about GNOME and HP
16:25:35 <oliverp_> sri: cool :)
16:25:40 <sri> I also had a nice talk with Allison Randal
16:25:56 <sri> who told me she will try out GNOME when she gets back to Seattle
16:26:01 <aday> sri, tell him they were a fool for letting WebOS go :)
16:26:04 <sri> apprently she hasn't tried it at all.
16:26:15 <sri> hah, I'll mention that.. alhtough not hteir dept.
16:26:21 <sri> they've had bad management unforutnately.
16:26:45 <sri> I haven't talked to them yet, so I'll wait awhile bfore contacting htem
16:26:54 <sri> I'll use my contact to give me an intro
16:26:58 <sri> rather than cold mailing him.
16:27:15 <oliverp_> sri: sounds great.
16:27:23 <sri> so, good stuff there.  I hope that leads to HP joining the advisory board.
16:27:26 <oliverp_> sri: you also talked to valve, right
16:27:30 <sri> which is where I"m heading iwth it.
16:27:36 <sri> yep, get to that in next
16:27:46 <sri> #info talked iwth HP, had good fruitful talks about invigorating the HP dekstop
16:28:09 <sri> #info will have a discussion with the R&D director at HP regarding GNOME
16:28:20 <sri> I hpoe that we can at least make an argument to use GNOME internally.
16:28:29 <sri> at HP like we do at Yahoo
16:28:40 <sri> okay, on to Valve
16:28:46 <sri> I had a great discussion with Valve
16:28:52 <sri> they plan on particpating in west coast hackfest
16:28:58 <sri> I finally got myself a contact that I can mail directly
16:29:03 <aday> sri, yay!
16:29:05 <sri> they are very interested in application sandboxing
16:29:24 <sri> I plan on senidng my contact the link to the email thread regarding the discusison on GNOME runtime
16:29:39 <sri> I think we really want them to partner with us on this.
16:29:52 <sri> they were actually interested to ocme this year, but the timing was really bad
16:30:00 <sri> they were on vacation, otherwise they would have come this year as wlel.
16:30:15 <sri> so, really great to have some contact with them
16:30:26 <aday> sri, i had someone from one of the IVI consortia approach me about app sandboxing at guadec
16:30:37 <sri> aday: oh yeah? that's awesome..who?
16:30:43 <aday> seems like there's an opportunity to engage stakeholders around this
16:30:56 <sri> aday: applicaiton sandboxing is a killer feature
16:30:59 <aday> sri, genivi
16:31:02 <sri> okay
16:31:07 <sri> yeah, I know those ugys through Tizen
16:31:20 <sri> Tizen uses SMACK for the security stuff
16:31:37 <sri> Ryan Lortie and I have been talking about SMACK a little bit.
16:31:55 <aday> i wonder how we would do that, and whether alex would be interested
16:31:55 <sri> core guys are not adverse to SMACK, (a security kernel thing like SELinux)
16:32:21 <sri> I talked iwth alex about hti sbefore, they basically said they won't object to it, patches accepted.
16:32:22 <aday> i guess we could advertise a working group or something, ask if people want to participate
16:32:24 <sri> for SMACK stuff
16:32:40 <sri> yeah, we can put it on west coast hackfest agenda as well.  The SMACK maintainer is in california
16:32:42 <aday> there needs to be a thing that these partners can get hold of
16:33:11 <sri> I will tell you this, what we are doing iwth hte run time and stuff?  It will really help starting discussions iwth companies
16:33:17 <sri> this is real innovation
16:33:28 <sri> with high impact.
16:33:52 <sri> #info Valve guys were happy to work with GNOME on applicattion sandboxing, will like to participate in west coast hackfest
16:34:11 <sri> #info segue about SMACK and GNOME from this discussion
16:34:23 <aday> it's amazing really. we've talked about it for so long as The Thing we need to do, and when we get around to it, we see an instant reaction
16:34:28 <sri> #info GNOME runtime is a great example of technical leadership
16:34:38 <sri> aday: :)
16:34:42 <andreasn-away> sri: you mean Gunnar?
16:34:56 <sri> gunnar?
16:34:59 <aday> WE WERE RIGHT ALL ALONG!
16:35:01 <sri> sorry don't reognize the name.
16:35:01 <andreasn-away> the IVI guy
16:35:02 <aday> wa ha ha
16:35:16 <aday> andreasn-away, yeah. i introduced him to alex
16:35:22 <andreasn-away> cool
16:35:25 <sri> I never met Gunnar
16:35:30 <sri> or I don't remember
16:35:32 <aday> sri, really nice
16:35:40 <sri> aday: :)
16:35:42 <andreasn-away> could be someone else then
16:35:57 <sri> #info aday says we were right the whole time :D
16:36:00 * sri laughs.
16:36:12 <andreasn-away> I need to run, but aday, if you need any help with the release notes, like screenshots and stuff, let me know
16:36:16 <andreasn-away> later!
16:36:25 <sri> okay, so one last thing is that Valve agreed to give us keys to test valve games on shell.
16:36:28 <aday> andreasn-away, will do!
16:36:35 <sri> thanks andreasn-away :)
16:36:49 <oliverp_> sri: oh reailly cool
16:36:59 <sri> so, I need to pick a couple of people who want access to the valve game
16:37:10 <sri> it would ahve been nice to have access to more games but whatver.
16:37:29 <sri> so lastly, I did lightning talk on community management
16:37:49 <sri> it went okay, I thought it was a little muddled
16:37:51 <oliverp_> sri: it was great, willl send you the picture
16:38:02 <oliverp_> sri: I hope you remeber it :)
16:38:08 <aday> sri, i guess those should go to shell developers
16:38:13 <sri> one piee of feedback was that it was the most extrovert talk, and that itself was unusual
16:38:28 <sri> aday: yep, hte keys should go to some shell developers
16:39:14 <sri> also, ryan told me that a lot of people liked my talk and that I am a great salesperson for GNOME
16:39:32 <aday> sri, you are!
16:39:41 <oliverp_> sri:+1
16:39:47 <sri> #notes sri gave a talk, that was received well, and people thought GNOME was well represented.
16:39:54 <sri> thanks :)
16:40:08 <sri> it's great to get that feedback from a different community
16:40:21 <sri> debconf was fun, and it is something we should always make a point of attending
16:40:34 <sri> I got a lot out of it.
16:40:51 <sri> so I'm done iwth debconf
16:42:01 <aday> should we review upcoming conferences, or move on to 3.14 marketing?
16:44:56 <oliverp_> I had one thing in mind
16:45:25 <sri> move on to 3.14 that is more important.
16:45:33 <oliverp_> aday: what do you think about a London hackfest, is not late to organszine one now?
16:45:48 <oliverp_> *is it to late?
16:46:07 <aday> oliverp_, depends when we want to have it!
16:46:26 <aday> sri, you are the meetbot master
16:46:29 <oliverp_> aday: in October, around the 18th
16:46:50 <oliverp_> or after the 27th
16:46:54 <sri> #topic 3.14 PI release
16:46:56 <ikey|away> 18th is a saturday. ill come though if im invited :p
16:47:06 <aday> oliverp_, a month might be a bit short notice. those dates are to coincide with linuxcon?
16:47:27 <aday> #info 3.14 release notes are in progress (although a little behind schedule)
16:47:44 <aday> should be done by the end of the week/beginning of next
16:47:45 <oliverp_> aday: was the point not to have very close to Linuxcon?
16:47:55 <oliverp_> *have it
16:48:21 <aday> oliverp_, let's come back to this
16:48:32 <oliverp_> aday: ok
16:48:50 <aday> i'm getting there with the release notes. the text just needs tidying, then it'll be screenshot time
16:49:05 <aday> but i have been a big FAIL when it comes to press release quotes
16:49:16 <aday> sri, have you made any progress there?
16:49:43 <sri> I have failed too
16:49:59 <sri> and really it should be on me and karen for those, you can't be expected to release notes and quotes
16:50:08 <sri> I'm going ot ask valve. :)
16:50:15 <sri> let's see if they are interested in giving a quote.
16:50:17 <oliverp_> me to...
16:50:31 <sri> we're running out of people to ask. :/
16:50:55 <aday> sri, i have email addresses for dreamworks and ibm. just haven't got around to doing anything with them
16:51:13 <sri> okay, let's mak ea pact to send email to our contacts today
16:51:33 <aday> i have a mental block for this stuff
16:51:41 <sri> #action send email to companies to get quotes - aday: ibm and dreamworks sri: valve
16:51:47 <aday> i should have never volunteered
16:51:49 <sri> aday: send it to karen and see if she will do it :)
16:51:56 <sri> aday: hah
16:52:06 <sri> aday: it's okay, give it ot me or karen, we will do it. :)
16:52:20 <sri> karen might be better, since she is internationally known
16:52:52 <aday> true. or maybe i should JFDI
16:53:30 <aday> seems that bastian is getting on with a video too, which is great news
16:54:06 <sri> #info bastian is moving swiftly to complete the video
16:54:57 <oliverp_> sri: that great news!
16:55:16 <oliverp_> I hope I can provide some feedback once he have published a draft
16:55:40 <aday> anything else we should be looking at for 3.14 marketing?
16:55:53 <sri> well..
16:56:00 <sri> articles for opensource.com?
16:56:15 <aday> ah yea
16:56:26 <sri> the person who corrected me on hte ML is one of hte editors of opensource.com :)
16:56:48 <aday> what kind of thing would they be interested in, do you think?
16:57:21 <sri> well, I think we should talk about our stack
16:57:31 <sri> our desktop stuff is kind of minor at the moment, right?
16:57:46 <aday> depends on your perspective
16:58:08 <sri> so, for me strategically, I rather talk about our stack
16:58:26 <sri> becaues it's been getting a hit lately
16:58:32 <sri> I was going ot write a blog post but this might be better.
16:58:40 <aday> there's a decent amount of developer features to talk about for 3.14 - gtk inspector, gestures, the hig, wayland progress, improved css support
16:58:49 <aday> mclasen would be the one to get involved there
16:58:56 <sri> I will talk with him about it.
16:58:58 <aday> or jasper
16:59:07 <sri> he won't want to write it, but I'll let him give me all the relevant info
16:59:23 <aday> sri, you can get it from the release notes too.
16:59:41 <sri> aday: I'll use both.
16:59:50 <sri> rely on the release notes first, and then ask mclasen if htere is anything else.
17:00:30 <aday> sri, sounds good. i've bugged him plenty for the material that's in there
17:01:12 <sri> #action sri to write an opensource.com article to support the release, talk about our stack.  Work with Matthias and Jasper as well as use the release notes
17:01:33 <aday> sri, you could spin it to talk about long-term plans/trends
17:01:35 <sri> I think that is about all I can do release wise
17:01:51 <aday> wayland, touch, app sandboxing
17:01:55 <sri> yes!
17:02:16 <aday> maybe ebassi's scene graph stuff
17:02:18 <aday> css
17:02:19 <sri> #notes aday suggests also spinning it into long-term plans/trends - wayland, touch, app sandobxing
17:02:32 <sri> #notes ebassi scene graph, css etc
17:02:46 <sri> #notes HIG, cross-platform support
17:02:52 <ikey|away> "redefining the Linux userland security and distribution model" :P
17:03:04 <sri> indeedy
17:03:32 <sri> hey, am I allowed to knock cinnamon? :-) J/K
17:03:48 <sri> our stack can support other desktops, no need to fork :P
17:03:53 <ikey|away> they do it fine by themselves. ooo burn.
17:03:54 * ikey|away hides
17:04:20 <aday> sri, developer tooling could be another - inspector + builder
17:04:27 <sri> I'll let you do the knocking on cinnamon
17:04:34 <ikey|away> :D
17:04:42 <sri> #notes developer tooling inspector + builder
17:04:56 <aday> i love cinnamon
17:04:58 <sri> I've been really encouraged by volunteers stepping up, that too on hard stuff
17:05:00 <aday> in a bun
17:05:04 <sri> aday: haha
17:05:14 <sri> I love cinnamon.. on toast
17:06:26 <ikey|away> Budgie pwns Cinnamon.
17:06:27 <sri> okay, anything else on this?
17:06:39 <sri> I need to deal with the QA team for this release.
17:07:08 <sri> you really need to change the name to bhajji
17:07:18 <sri> a yummy frieind snack
17:07:21 <sri> htat's good with sauce
17:07:25 <sri> *fried
17:07:34 <ikey|away> file a feature request :P
17:07:35 * ikey|away runs
17:07:38 <sri> hah
17:07:40 <aday> i need to go in a couple of minutes
17:07:49 <aday> oliverp_, shall we quickly discuss hackfests?
17:08:01 <sri> #topic hackfests
17:08:02 <oliverp_> aday: yes please
17:08:12 <sri> okay, let's do it.
17:08:46 <oliverp_> right so I guess we must decide in the very near future if we want to do a late October marketing hackfest
17:09:15 <aday> the idea for october was to get karen and sri involved, if they were over for linuxcon
17:09:40 <oliverp_> aday: do you know if karen will come to linuxcon?
17:09:58 <aday> oliverp_, i haven't heard that she will. linuxcon can be a bit last minute with travel funding
17:10:12 <aday> but she seemed doubtful
17:10:13 <oliverp_> aday: reailly
17:10:15 <oliverp_> hm
17:10:37 <oliverp_> aday: do you suggest that we skip the hackfest?
17:10:47 <aday> if we aren't aiming to coincide with linuxcon, we can do a plan B and do a small european event
17:10:53 <sri> ugh, I'm not sure if I can make linuxcon, company won't pay unless I'm giving a talk
17:10:54 <aday> but the timing is less critical
17:11:14 <sri> andI think the talk deadline is already over.
17:11:16 <aday> oliverp_, honestly, october is looking bad for me. i need to take some holiday, and i'm moving place
17:11:25 <oliverp_> aday: for me its not
17:11:26 <sri> we hsould send hadess, he was willing to go
17:11:26 <aday> s/place/flat
17:11:39 <sri> last i heard, I thought karen had gotten funding.
17:11:42 <oliverp_> or it is critical in a sense
17:11:59 <aday> i think winter would be good - start of the cycle, and all that
17:12:30 <aday> oliverp_, maybe we should check on people's availability
17:12:35 <aday> but i have to run now!
17:12:36 <oliverp_> becuse I must know a date rahter soon so I can ask Mozilla to book a flight to anohter day
17:12:48 <aday> sorry!
17:12:49 <oliverp_> if we are doing the hackfest
17:13:22 <sri> anything else to add, oliverp_ regarding hackfests?
17:13:26 <oliverp_> aday: asked the list a few days ago, not many responded
17:14:11 <oliverp_> aday: well if we don't set a date rahter soon, I guess I will miss the hackfest (if its going to happen)
17:14:37 <ikey|away> erm. aday left. :s
17:14:41 <sri> yep, he did
17:14:55 <oliverp_> right
17:15:07 * ikey|away puts "observation skills" on his CV ^_^
17:15:37 <oliverp_> well I guess the meeting is finshed
17:15:54 <ikey|away> What kind of hackfest btw, what focus?
17:16:00 * ikey|away would love to go to one at some poitn
17:16:05 <ikey|away> *point
17:16:14 <ikey|away> This channel just purely interferes with your keyboard..
17:16:22 <oliverp_> ikey|away: I sugesst you read the list
17:16:35 <oliverp_> its not not very hard to find out
17:16:55 <ikey|away> Right, but it would've been easier to give a straight answer. Given you're here and talking about it.
17:17:01 <ikey|away> Nonetheless I shall go grep the list.
17:17:52 <oliverp_> marketing hackfest in London
17:17:52 <ikey|away> ty
17:18:25 <ikey|away> London is technically geographically close but marketing is not my area. ^^ (I live closer to France.)
17:18:36 <sri> okay, 'm going to end the meeting
17:18:41 <sri> #endmeeting